Gun Ban sunsets!

[gr81]

actually I said nothing along those lines, and AIDS is a tragedy, of course, but it has nothing to do with guns now does it. I sympathise with the vitctims of the Florida hurricances, and ok I will buy that as an instance where maybe guns were a necessity. However I am speaking in generalizations, not to the exception. I don't see what AIDS or banning homosexuals has anything to do with the amount of homicides we have each year as a result of gun deaths. I realize its somewhat of a situation where we have opened pandora's box and theres not much we can do. but despite the horrific tragedy we may experience, we don't need guns, and when these instances occur, I will personally volunteer to hand guns out to those who need them. Until then do we really need to continue to shoot each other?

 

[pmech]

Garauntee that all criminals do not have access to guns, and I will give mine up. And no, banning guns sales in the us will not garauntee this.

 

[kbm8795]

And here I was thinkin' that if we just eliminated all the fascists masquerading as conservatives, we wouldn't need any guns to protect ourselves from the threats of a dictatorship. . .hehehe

Now the right to bear arms is an integral part of our Constitutional heritage - and while I wouldn't like the idea of each person being given surface-to-air missiles as high school graduation presents, I don't believe in restricting anyone's rights. I don't think that ban has been that effective, and people are killed whether by a semi-automatic or a single gunshot wound. Most gun-owners I know are generally very responsible - many learned shooting as a practical skill from their parents and grandparents and use it for hunting and as a last resort for self-defense.

While some accidents occur (and accidents occur involving just about everything we use in this society) I believe they are in the minority involving responsible owners. Yep, every now and again someone snaps - but if they didn't use a gun, they'd use a homemade bomb, a vehicle, kitchen knives or whatever is handy to take their life or the life of someone else. In a strange way, I think the government has more control by keeping them legalized - they know how many are registered, it helps law enforcement track stolen property and it might reduce some black market activity. There are probably lots of cases where law enforcement officials were able to solve a crime faster because the object used was a registered weapon.

Moreover, it's a constitutional right. I wish Stickboy was around right now - I remember him posting something about how he wasn't allowed to use a certain type rocket for one of his hobbies, because it was prohibited by the government. I'd enjoy seeing him explain more about that regulation and why it is in place.

Now while I wouldn't want my alcoholic neighbor to be able to purchase a ballistic missile, or for motorists to mount heatseeking missiles on the front of their cars during rush hour, I think most collectors are not only discreet but very careful about their firearms. Responsible people don't brandish their weapons out in public or wave them around at others - taking them out and using them for target practice or hunting is a carefully self-regulated event. And self-defense is just that. . .responsible owners know that a weapon is used only in response to a direct and imminent threat.

 

[Chain Link]

(including suicides and unintentional shootings), as compiled by the National Center for Health Statistics, have only been collected since 1979. But between 1979 and 1997, 651,697 Americans lost their lives to gun violence, including 334,870 suicides, 278,865 homicides, 28,964 unintentional shootings

Thank you for clearing that up, you just confirmed the number I didnt want to post incase it was wrong, but the average gun deaths a year is somewhere around 17k, not 30k. now consider 2/3 of those homicides are criminals on criminals, then self defense, and law enforcement shooting. OH MY GOD, Its horrible.. That means maybe like, 1k innocent people die a year, we should definitely BAN guns so that those 1k will live so they can be one of the 100,000 to 4,000,000 people who were physically unable to defend themselves a year, and get raped, beaten, or killed. Thanks for the stats. Those suiciders really needed guns though. I once tried to kill myself by inhaling the carbon monoxide fumes from my tailpipe, but I burnt my lips and gave up.

The number one cause of death among young African Americans is homicide.

Well at this point in American history, I cant comment on anything concerning a colored race, even statistics, that would descriminate one skin tone, or ethnic orgin from another, since Id be racist, But do consider the race of who was at hand of these murders. Also consider the age limits on this term of,"young" Often such a term extends to the age of 17, sometimes longer.
Also, young people dont have many causes of death to compete since they dont die alot.

 

[Chain Link]

I will personally volunteer to hand guns out to those who need them.

You cant be serious. Imagine the panic you would cause. That plan would get countless people killed in a time of need. Furthermore, you cant just jump into your teleporter and santa clause yourway around an entire area of said magnitude in a single night.

 

[gr81]

it was sarcasm

 

[Chain Link]

it was sarcasm

@me. Sorry, didnt catch it.

 

[pu239]

Wow, if you say you've talked to some reputable people I believe you. But I sure thought silencers fell under a FEDERAL law the superceded any state laws. It might not be a bad idea to call the BATF just to cover your ass.

You're definitely correct ALBOB, Federal law supercedes state law. Federal law allows suppressors to be on guns and Virginia doesn't have any laws against it either. That's what I was trying to say. I did talk to the BATF once when I requested the form. I'll do some more research, but I have a friend that has cans on both of his M-16s and the sheriff comes out to shoot them with him. The sheriff isn't a federal law enforcement official, but I can't imagine he would willingly participate in breaking federal law.

 

[OceanDude]

^^ When Federal law is silent or fuzzy state law prevails until someone ties it back to the Constitution or other case law through a court challenge. Laws are shot full of holes though (pun intended) and change in slant from administration to administration as priorities shift. I suspect a good attorney could make the case for silencers by playing the bureaucrats against each other and argue that due to city noise ordinances we need silencers (or at least more dead people since they don't make noise).
OD

 

[ZECH]

The number one cause of death among young African Americans is homicide.

And probably 99% is drug related. So why do I care? To me that is another drug dealer off the street.

 

[ALBOB]

I once tried to kill myself by inhaling the carbon monoxide fumes from my tailpipe, but I burnt my lips and gave up.

OMFG!!!

In other words your were BORN brain damaged and it's only gotten worse with age.

Sorry man, I couldn't resist.

 

[Chain Link]

OMFG!!!

In other words your were BORN brain damaged and it's only gotten worse with age.

Sorry man, I couldn't resist.

Stop maeking phung uf me.

 

[maniclion]

My step-father a guncollecting bounty hunter licensed to carry a firearm was killed with a Louisville Slugger. I say ban baseball bats and baseball.

 

[gr81]

And probably 99% is drug related. So why do I care? To me that is another drug dealer off the street.

...wow... I am speachless... I mean I don't even know what to say... all joking aside this is just the lowest thing you could've possibly replied with. you really are a racist piece of shit and it saddens me that I have to walk the planet with cockroaches like yourself. What the fucc makes you better than any of those people, besides the fact that you were born into a much more prominent economic status and they weren't? You are gonna rot in hell for being so pretentious and judgemental, and if I ever come across you best believe your trip there is gonna come much quicker.. don't even bother replying, you are on ignore.. have a nice day piggy

 

[Chain Link]

My step-father a guncollecting bounty hunter licensed to carry a firearm was killed with a Louisville Slugger. I say ban baseball bats and baseball.

http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/showthread.php?t=35126
Thats already in the works, please write your government officials.
Is that true though? If so, Im sorry to hear it. Id prefer to be shot..lol. Just proves that if somebody wants to kill someone else, they can, and will do it, even without a gun, and even if its a trained officer(or bounty hunter.. who I believe have more lenient rules for using force.)

 

[Jeeper]

I think it is funny that no-one wanted to ban box cutters after 9/11 since the the gun haters always blame the weapon and not the criminal.

As far as assault weapons being useless--Anyone remember the asian store owners on their roofs with AK-47's during the Rodney King riots in LA. They used them to protect themselves againt losing their businesses and possibly their lives. But I guess something like that could never happen again.

I forget who posted that machine guns are illegal but that is not necessarily true. They are legal under federal law with the purchase of a tax stamp(class III license) Silencers are also covered under this law since it is federal. They question about VA law is that some states have banned class 3 stuff. VA simply allows it. The federal regulations are still controlling since they are directly on point and the sumpremecy clause dictates federal control.

 

[OceanDude]

All I know is I want to be the first on my block to own a surface to surface missile so I can put it as a hood ornament on my car and practice "defensive driving" when I see some lunatic truck driver barreling down 1" off my rear bumper to compel me to drive 90 mph on the interstate...

OD

 

[ZECH]

...wow... I am speachless... I mean I don't even know what to say... all joking aside this is just the lowest thing you could've possibly replied with. you really are a racist piece of shit and it saddens me that I have to walk the planet with cockroaches like yourself. What the fucc makes you better than any of those people, besides the fact that you were born into a much more prominent economic status and they weren't? You are gonna rot in hell for being so pretentious and judgemental, and if I ever come across you best believe your trip there is gonna come much quicker.. don't even bother replying, you are on ignore.. have a nice day piggy

What is racist about this comment? Not a damn thing! For one, I'm not a drug dealer shooting or killing people for a few bucks or a fix. What makes you think I was born more prominent? My mother and father was scrapping for everything they could when me and my two brothers were born. They have as just as much chance of making something of theirself as I did. The difference is my mother and father taught me right from wrong and I choose to live according to society's standard. So don't bring this racists shit up to me. You are the piece of shit. And I invite you to come see me any time you want. But I know you are chicken shit. You just run your fucking mouth. You are the epitomy of society's problems!

 

[Supermans Daddy]

What is racist about this comment? Not a damn thing! For one, I'm not a drug dealer shooting or killing people for a few bucks or a fix. What makes you think I was born more prominent? My mother and father was scrapping for everything they could when me and my two brothers were born. They have as just as much chance of making something of theirself as I did. The difference is my mother and father taught me right from wrong and I choose to live according to society's standard. So don't bring this racists shit up to me. You are the piece of shit. And I invite you to come see me any time you want. But I know you are chicken shit. You just run your fucking mouth. You are the epitomy of society's problems!

Hey , just for tha record, every drug dealer or user is not Black! Not every crime is not "drug related if black people are involved.As a matter of fact tha biggest Dopeman in my city is a cat called " whiteboy Rick". GR is not Black, but I am, and think that shit you said was racist bullshit.I got a feel'n I know what your feelings are about my next statement will be already but here goes anyway. I came to this country from Jamaica, from a totally different society where " you would be tha minority". There's way more people killed here than in my mostly black little island .And by tha way people have guns there too.I really did'nt learn bout racist shit ( firsthand)till I got here. I love this country but I've seen it through eyes that you can bet have seen "society's standards" as you put it in a way that would blow your mind. 2 yrs after I got here my uncle was "lynched" in ALA. what you know bout that part of society? Nobody got caught or did One day for his murder, I can promise you that it was not "drug related" or any kind of crime on his part as he was a preacher and just happened to be as you'd most likely relate to " a nigga in tha wrong place". I never heard of anyone get'n lynched back in Jamaica. I'm strapped not for any other reason than I'm not get'n robbed by a Blackman or tha police(yeah they steal too !I know as I've personally been robbed by tha police) and I don't plan on me my wife or my kid,get'n strung up by one of your boys either. Basically my 9 is color blind .I got a gang of guns for same reason as anyone really , cause I'm scared not to have one if I need it. Thats real BTW gett'n a strap( any kind) here is easier than get'n gas for your car.

 

[maniclion]

Hey , just for tha record, every drug dealer or user is Black! Not every crime is not "drug related if black people are involved.As a matter of fact tha biggest Dopeman in my city is a cat called " whiteboy Rick".

Yeah, how about all the mullet wearin' crackers killin' each other over "ICE" in the midwest?

 

[ALBOB]

I really hesitate to jump in here, but dg806 is a good friend of mine and I feel I need to stick up for him. The original statement was "The #1 cause of death among young African Americans is homicide." His claim was that most of those homicides were DRUG RELATED and that was OK with him because it meant one more DRUG DEALER off the streets. His comment was NOT directed at blacks, whites or any other color of the rainbow. His comment was directed at DRUG DEALERS. On that point I happen to agree with him. I'm pretty sure most of you aren't huge fans of the type of drug dealers who are messing up our streets. Let's face it, this is an internet chat site, I have no way in the world of proving to you dg806 is NOT a racist. You're just going to have to trust me on that. If you don't feel I deserve that trust I completely understand. Like I said, this is just a chat site. There's not much more I can do or say but to give you my word, he's NOT a racist.

 

[BoneCrusher]

I live here in Texas where I can carry a handgun. Try and come in my home and rob me or harm my family. Make the attempt to kidnap, carjack, mug, rape or in someway cause harm to come to me or mine while I am there if it pleases you. Make out a will first, then get right with God.

It is not my job to judge your actions for trying to harm me or mine. That is God's province. I'll just bring the two of you together.

 

[Jeeper]

I'm strapped not for any other reason than I'm not get'n robbed by a Blackman or tha police(yeah they steal too !I know as I've personally been robbed by tha police) and I don't plan on me my wife or my kid,get'n strung up by one of your boys either. Basically my 9 is color blind .I got a gang of guns for same reason as anyone really , cause I'm scared not to have one if I need it. Thats real BTW gett'n a strap( any kind) here is easier than get'n gas for your car.

It is funny to me that the black community usually supports the liberal view on gun control. I commend Mikhal's view as it is the view I would take if I were black. Gun control laws in this country really began to appear after the civil war. They were mainly concerned with ex-slaves being able to defend themselves against white lynch gangs. They banned ex-slaves from being able to protect themselves so that they could still exert power over them. The true roots of gun control in this country are from a racist objective.

 

[BoneCrusher]

It is funny to me that the black community usually supports the liberal view on gun control. I commend Mikhal's view as it is the view I would take if I were black. Gun control laws in this country really began to appear after the civil war. They were mainly concerned with ex-slaves being able to defend themselves against white lynch gangs. They banned ex-slaves from being able to protect themselves so that they could still exert power over them. The true roots of gun control in this country are from a racist objective.

I'll make you a deal. You post a real source for the claim that gun control is racially motivated and I'll not call you an idiot. I'll give you a while ...

 

[OceanDude]

Hey all, just chill. Everyone knows GR81 likes to fight - it's his thing and his idium. He and I use to get into it all the time - that was our thing (still is). I don't take it too seriously and nor should anyone else. Chill all. In a day or two it will be back to normal again and he will drop the "iggy" on dg806 since GR81 can't stand to go more than a few days without debating and fighting somone and DG is a great and fun target for him. Now that I am back on the boards I'll take the heat for a few days to fill the gap. It's what makes IM what it is - a street brawl lol...

OD

 

[maniclion]

I doubt there are any racists here (besides Rich), most of them hangout at their own forums and lift each others ego's since the rest of the net is Jewish propaganda in their minds. We used to log in to them in the Navy (before they restricted the net) and tear them apart. If you want to see some fucked up points of view search around for these sites, they are completely demented.

 

[BoneCrusher]

And probably 99% is drug related. So why do I care? To me that is another drug dealer off the street.

Gotta say that if one drug dealer kills another drug dealer than see ya! Don't wanna be ya! No racism involved ... just normal thinking here. DG is right about it GR81. Why is this racial?

 

[Jeeper]

I'll make you a deal. You post a real source for the claim that gun control is racially motivated and I'll not call you an idiot. I'll give you a while ...

If you read my post a little closer you will realize that I didnt say that today's gun control is racially motivated. I said that the original gun control laws("the roots of gun control") were racially motivated. I will be happy to post a link to information about this if you dont believe me. One of the greatest supreme court lawyers of our day wrote an excellent book talking about the "free-man laws and the 14th amendment".

 

[gr81]

its racist b/c I said, the number one cause death of AFRICAN AMERICANS between a certain age group is homicide, and he said that 99% of those deaths were mosy likely drug deals or drug related, categorizing most african americans as DRUG DEALERS, as if other ethnicities aren't doing drug. This is not teh first racist thing that DG has said, not by a long shit. Everyone that isn't just like him, or doesn't believe in the same thinsg he does is a piece of shit according to him. To make such a blanket statement about people who are poor is so ignorant its disgusting, but yeah I am the reason society has problems, ok man. you ain't shit DG and you prove it everytime you open your mouth.

 

[BoneCrusher]

If you read my post a little closer you will realize that I didnt say that today's gun control is racially motivated. I said that the original gun control laws("the roots of gun control") were racially motivated. I will be happy to post a link to information about this if you dont believe me. One of the greatest supreme court lawyers of our day wrote an excellent book talking about the "free-man laws and the 14th amendment".

I saw your point Jeeper. The history of many issues CAN be related to racism. That does not justify propagating racism by allowing that to continue. When you associate the goals of the politicians that framed the now defunct gun control laws with assholes in history that used the law to put down black Americans you promote racist tensions uselessly.

You began your post agreeing with M and saying you would and that gun control laws were based in . I have seen real racism and its issues from growing up in Cleveland Ohio. The white people there then even hated each other. The Irish fought the Italians, the Lithuanians had to fight the Germans. Black and whites did not get along for the most part. High school football games only really began after the forth quarter was ended ??? out in the parking lot. I grew up in some of the black neighborhoods and projects and have been jumped for being a white boy on the wrong street. A black bus driver for being white kicked me off a bus.

My first roommate was black. I have a black Godson. I see people use racism as a tool for self gain or social acceptance, and I see racism as a reality for my Godson. Many other instances of racially motivated trouble have given me insight into real racism. These two are very separate and equally fucked instances. Gun control laws are not racist, nor are they historically racial as they were written in the now dead ban. To start connecting things that are not releated is just going to start more shit. I know you did not start it Jeeper, but don't fuel it or get sucked into it. This kind of shit only makes it harder on people that really are getting discriminated against.