Mormons

[exphys88]

Just fyi, snakes talking is not in the original Hebrew, its a translation issue. It should have been correctly translated shinning one. I have seen you post this a few times but without knowing the Hebrew you are relying on an English translation which may have some issues.

The Hebrew word for the serpent is nachash, or literally Shining One.
-Adam and Eve likely taken in by a very intelligent supernatural angel of light who is able to talk them into believing extra insight to what God really meant.
(Satan as an angel of light) 2[SUP]nd[/SUP] Corinthians 11:14

Anyway, just thought I would educate you on the Hebrew translation =)

Oic, a supernatural angel of light. Lol

Makes perfect sense. Once again you are making a huge assumption that there is a supernatural anything.

 

[exphys88]

i really doubt most christians actually believe that stuff lol.. and as heavyiron stated.. a lot has gotten lost in translation.

You should check your assumptions, a huge percentage of American Christians believe in a literal interpretation of the bible.

 

[exphys88]

30% of Americans believe n a literal interpretation.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/148427/say-bible-literally.aspx

 

[LAM]

You should check your assumptions, a huge percentage of American Christians believe in a literal interpretation of the bible.

I had this convo with one of my buddies the other week. he even knew that the bible was a hodgepodge compilation of stories compiled over a long period of time by many authors. it's quite the contradiction.

ultimately I think it mainly has to do with how a persons belief system shapes their own individual view of reality combined with genetic and environmental factors.

 

[slownsteady]

I think, men are that they might have joy. I believe we all have feelings of hope. I believe in free agency. I think we are either acting or being acted upon. I would rather act than be acted upon. I think men often look beyond the mark. I believe charity never fails. I believe in serving others. I believe that love is a verb or action word. I believe man was created in God's image. I believe only God can judge a mans heart. I think all men are pea-brains compared to God. I think we will be judged according to our own understandings, expieriances, and that we should not judge any man, unless we be judged the same. I believe we are free to choose good works or to do bad.

 

[exphys88]

It's obvious that god was created in our image because he usually hates the same people we do.

I believe god is a flying spaghetti monster who loves pirates. There is scientific proof to back this up.

 

[Standard Donkey]

30% of Americans believe n a literal interpretation.

In U.S., 3 in 10 Say They Take the Bible Literally

which supports my assumption that most dont believe in a literal interpretation....


...

 

[exphys88]

which supports my assumption that most dont believe in a literal interpretation....


...

Considering that 60-80% of Americans are Christians, that would mean that 38-50% of the Christians in the US believe in the literal interpretation. Hardly a minority. that is an astounding number for the year 2012. These idiots actually believe we all descended from Adam and eve 6000 years ago.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_the_United_States#section_10

 

[NVRBDR]

I just saw beach blanket babylon, and I just found out this Mitt guy is one of those. No offense, but keep that religious stuff out of our political arena, we've had enough wars over the "good book." We already have those with the Allah, prayer service day in and day out and look what a mess that is.

(It seems every missionary person from the 15th century on has then gotten us more and more pages of history with Imperialism and Wars.)

Abe Lincoln disagrees with you.

[TABLE="width: 85%, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]"We have forgotten God. We have forgotten the gracious hand which preserved us in peace and multiplied and enriched and strengthened us, and we have vainly imagined, in the deceitfulness of our hearts, that all these blessings were produced by some superior wisdom and virtue of our own. Intoxicated with unbroken success, we have become too self-sufficient to feel the necessity of redeeming and preserving grace, too proud to pray to the God that made us."
Abraham Lincoln's 1863 Thanksgiving Proclamation
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

 

[exphys88]

Abe Lincoln disagrees with you.

[TABLE="width: 85%, align: center"]
[TR]
[TD]"We have forgotten God. We have forgotten the gracious hand which preserved us in peace and multiplied and enriched and strengthened us, and we have vainly imagined, in the deceitfulness of our hearts, that all these blessings were produced by some superior wisdom and virtue of our own. Intoxicated with unbroken success, we have become too self-sufficient to feel the necessity of redeeming and preserving grace, too proud to pray to the God that made us."
Abraham Lincoln's 1863 Thanksgiving Proclamation[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Here are some quotes from our founding fathers regarding christianity:

Thomas Jefferson:

Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because if there be one he must approve of the homage of reason more than that of blindfolded fear. -Thomas Jefferson, letter to Peter Carr, August 10, 1787


"And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this the most venerated reformer of human errors." -- Jefferson's letter to John Adams, April 11 1823

"No one sees with greater pleasure than myself the progress of reason in its advances towards rational Christianity. When we shall have done away the incomprehensible jargon of the Trinitarian arithmetic, that three are one, and one is three; when we shall have knocked down the artificial scaffolding, raised to mask from view the simple structure of Jesus; when, in short, we shall have unlearned everything which has been taught since His day, and get back to the pure and simple doctrines He inculcated, we shall then be truly and worthily His disciples; and my opinion is that if nothing had ever been added to what flowed purely from His lips, the whole world would at this day have been Christian. I know that the case you cite, of Dr. Drake, has been a common one. The religion-builders have so distorted and deformed the doctrines of Jesus, so muffled them in mysticisms, fancies and falsehoods, have caricatured them into forms so monstrous and inconceivable, as to shock reasonable thinkers, to revolt them against the whole, and drive them rashly to pronounce its Founder an imposter. Had there never been a commentator, there never would have been an infidel." -- Jefferson's Letter to Timothy Pickering, 21 Feb 1821

John Adams:

"As I understand the Christian religion, it was, and is, a revelation. But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends, have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?" -letter to F.A. Van der Kamp, Dec. 27, 1816


James Madison:

"Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise." -letter to Wm. Bradford, April 1, 1774

 

[NVRBDR]

Here are several more quotes from our Founding Fathers on their belief in Christianity...


"It is the mutual duty of all to practice Christian forbearance, love, and charity toward each other." James Madison"

While we assert for ourselves a freedom to embrace, to profess, and to observe, the Religion which we believe to be of divine origin, we cannot deny an equal freedom to them whose minds have not yielded to the evidence which has convinced us." James Madison

At the Constitutional Convention of 1787, James Madison proposed the plan to divide the central government into three branches. He discovered this model of government from the Perfect Governor, as he read Isaiah 33:22;
"For the LORD is our judge, the LORD is our lawgiver,
the LORD is our king;
He will save us."

John Adams
2nd U.S. President and Signer of the Declaration of Independence
"Suppose a nation in some distant Region should take the Bible for their only law Book, and every member should regulate his conduct by the precepts there exhibited! Every member would be obliged in conscience, to temperance, frugality, and industry; to justice, kindness, and charity towards his fellow men; and to piety, love, and reverence toward Almighty God ... What a Eutopia, what a Paradise would this region be."

"Now I will avow, that I then believe, and now believe, that those general Principles of Christianity, are as eternal and immutable, as the Existence and Attributes of God; and that those Principles of Liberty, are as unalterable as human Nature and our terrestrial, mundane System." [SUB]
--Adams wrote this on June 28, 1813, excerpt from a letter to Thomas Jefferson.[/SUB]

Thomas Jefferson
3rd U.S. President, Drafter and Signer of the Declaration of Independence
"God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the Gift of God? That they are not to be violated but with His wrath? Indeed, I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that His justice cannot sleep forever; That a revolution of the wheel of fortune, a change of situation, is among possible events; that it may become probable by Supernatural influence! The Almighty has no attribute which can take side with us in that event." [SUB]
--Notes on the State of Virginia, Query XVIII, p. 237.[/SUB]

"I am a real Christian ? that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus Christ." [SUB]
--The Writings of Thomas Jefferson, p. 385.[/SUB]






Benjamin Franklin
Signer of the Declaration of Independence and Unites States Constitution
"Here is my Creed. I believe in one God, the Creator of the Universe. That He governs it by His Providence. That He ought to be worshipped.
"That the most acceptable service we render to him is in doing good to his other children. That the soul of man is immortal, and will be treated with justice in another life respecting its conduct in this. These I take to be the fundamental points in all sound religion, and I regard them as you do in whatever sect I meet with them.
"As to Jesus of Nazareth, my opinion of whom you particularly desire, I think the system of morals and his religion, as he left them to us, is the best the world ever saw, or is likely to see




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John Hancock
1st Signer of the Declaration of Independence
"Resistance to tyranny becomes the Christian and social duty of each individual. ... Continue steadfast and, with a proper sense of your dependence on God, nobly defend those rights which heaven gave, and no man ought to take from us." [SUB]
--History of the United States of America, Vol. II, p. 229.[/SUB]




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[NVRBDR]

I had this convo with one of my buddies the other week. he even knew that the bible was a hodgepodge compilation of stories compiled over a long period of time by many authors. it's quite the contradiction.

ultimately I think it mainly has to do with how a persons belief system shapes their own individual view of reality combined with genetic and environmental factors.

Consider the fact that the Bible is comprised of 66 Books written over a period of about 1,500 years by over 40 authors from all walks of life, with different kinds of personalities, and in all sorts of situations. It was written in three languages on three continents, and it covers hundreds of controversial subjects. Yet, it fits together into one cohesive story with an appropriate beginning, a logical ending, a central character, and a consistent theme.
How does one begin to explain such historical, structural, prophetic, doctrinal, and spiritual congruency (harmony) apart from the fact that its real author was Divine?

Also remember that these men were not writing about something as simple as an action adventure hero. They were dealing with controversial subjects, such as the meaning of life, the nature of God, angelic beings, and God's plan of redemption. These are matters on which it is generally not humanly possible to check the facts firsthand or to even fully understand, so as to write in complete agreement with all other biblical authors past and future. Yet, all 40 did write in unity and with authority. Either they were inspired, or they cheated to produce congruency.
The fact that the Bible has unity despite obvious differences in content, style, and perspective is a powerful witness to the independence of each author.
The Bible portrays an incredibly consistent picture of the Messiah throughout all 66 of its Books.

One should expect chaos from 40 different authors (most didn't know each other) on 3 different continents written over a period of 1500 years. The logical explanation is, "the bible is Gods Word".

 

[LAM]

Considering that 60-80% of Americans are Christians, that would mean that 38-50% of the Christians in the US believe in the literal interpretation. Hardly a minority. that is an astounding number for the year 2012. These idiots actually believe we all descended from Adam and eve 6000 years ago.

Religion in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Intelligence - Toward an index of well-being for the fifty U.S. states
http://www.people.vcu.edu/~mamcdani/Publications/Pesta, McDaniel & Bertsch (2010).pdf

page 6 Table 2 shows more than a casual link between religion, IQ, geographic location and other measures of well-being in the US

 

[heavyiron]

Oic, a supernatural angel of light. Lol

Makes perfect sense. Once again you are making a huge assumption that there is a supernatural anything.

I'm not making assumptions just showing you that the translation "shining one" instead of serpent is with further support in the NT.

Hebrew is not like English. Its more poetic and less rigid and precise. Our Western minds need to be reminded about that otherwise we take the text way too literally. I doubt the author meant a literal snake once you look at the use of the word in their culture. I realize some people view portions of scripture as historical narrative but to assume all believe its all historical narrative just isn't the case. Psalms are lyrics to songs for example. Revelation has many cryptic and prophetic sections which automatically prove its not all historical narrative or even literal. There are many examples of this in scripture so context of the documents must be carefully looked at before interpreting.

 

[SFW]

serpent almost always refers to beings from the draco constellation.


GICH