Need Help Arranging Workouts!

[J'Bo]

I need help arranging my new training routine.
These are the things i have to consider.

-Monday i have gymnastics in the PM, so i cant be too sore from training. Shoulders have to be in working order more than any other part.
-This is my split: bis/back, chest/tris, Legs, Shoulders
-I need alot of recovery after my shoulder and leg routines (cause they are intense)

This is what i am doing right now, but it isnt working out well.
Mon: Legs and Gymnastics
Tue: Rest
Wed: Chest/Tris
Thur: Rest
Fri: Shoulders
Sat: Rest
Sun: Back/Bis

Any ideas would help me out.

 

[quakin]

How 'bout:

Mon: Gymnastics
Tue: Chest/Tri
Wed: Legs
Thur: Rest
Fri: Shoulders
Sat: Back/Bi
Sun: Rest

Or, switch shoulders and chest/tri day around maybe.

And *all* your workouts should be intense.

 

[ezekiel]

If your shoulder workouts drain you to the point they interfere with your gymnastics on Monday I'd advise you to work your shoulders in the session immediately following your gymnastics session. That should give you maximum recovery time before your next gymnastics/shoulder session. Maybe something along the lines of ...

Monday - Gymnastics
Tuesday - Shoulders
Wednesday - Back/Bis
Thursday - Off
Friday - Legs
Saturday - Chest/Tris
Sunday - Off

Just a thought ...

Ezekiel

 

[Robboe]

How hard do shoulders get hit from gymnastics?

Have you considered dropping all shoulder work? Or just doing some side laterals on chest day? and freeing yourself another day of rest.

 

[J'Bo]

Thanks everyone for your suggestions they all look good. I will give them a try.

TCD, my shoulders get worked a bit from gymnastics. They are usually sore the next day. As for dropping shoulders all together, i dont think so cause they need alot of help. I know that i shouldnt over train them but just gymnastics for shoulders wont cut it. Isnt 3 days rest a week enough?

These are the two main things that i need in the training program: a rest after legs and a rest after shoulders

Anymore ideas?

 

[Robboe]

Originally posted by J'Bo
As for dropping shoulders all together, i dont think so cause they need alot of help.

Exact reasoning for dropping overhead work.

How long have you been training, and how long have your shoulders need the most work?

Are you not noticing a correlation here? Maybe your shoulders are getting too much work and are subsequently not growing as optimally as you'd like.

Your medial and especially your anterior deltoid heads are getting a lot of work from your chest day, no doubt. And your posterior delt from your back days.

As long as your pressing and pulling is progressing then your shoulder will grow - you just need to give them the rest for them to do so, hence, drop overhead work and drop the day altogether.

Put it this way, you defintaley won;t lose shoulder muscle by not doing them so since your shoulders already need work as you say, you've got nothing to lose. By doing too much you can easily locally overtrain the muscle and thus, potentially make it smaller.

Try it for 4-6 weeks and see how it goes. if you don;t like it, then start direct OH pressing again. Face it, 6 weeks in the scope of a lifetime is like a grain of sand on a beach.

Unless you die tomorrow of course...

 

[J'Bo]

Haha CD, no i am not planing on croaking anytime soon.

I have never really worked my shoulders hard before, i always wimped out.
I have been training serious for about 3 years and have made alot of gains all the way through. My strength has gone up ten fold from when i started out.
I used the shoulder workout that is posted in my journal for about 4 weeks in between my last two shows and it really pumped my shoulders up.
I dont see me having any gains if i dont train shoulders, i will try to space my workouts better and then if i am not responding well after 4-6 weeks then i will cut the shoulders out.

BTW: as per my last post about not having a chest routine that ripped the muscles and made me sore, i think spoke too soon. I CANT FEEL MY BOOBIES. LOL

 

[Robboe]

Ok the, keep shoulder work, but free up an extra day of rest by doing shoulders after chest and before triceps on 'push' day.

If you opt to do this, i suggest you work your schedule to have your newly made day of rest the day after gymnastics so any shoulder fatigue from it won't affect your chest workout. And use a day of rest before gymnastics so any possible back soreness from your 'pull' day doesn;t effect your performance.

An idea would be -

Mon: Gymnastics
Tue: rest
Wed: Chest/delts/tris
Thur: legs
Fri: rest
Sat: Back/Bi
Sun: Rest

 

[J'Bo]

Well that seems like a better idea.
There are only two problems:
-I will never be able to do the chest/delts/tris workout,i have a hard enough time doing chest/tris.
-I could never do legs after that workout because i wouldnt be able to move for the rest of the week.

Any more options.

 

[ponyboy]

How about switching around legs and chest/delt/tris? I realize that doing all three muscle groups may sound like a lot, but not if you hit them properly, since many exercises for one also hit the others. Also, you can spend the day after legs doing most exercises lying or sitting on a bench and you won't be able to use your legs for leverage, which might help things somewhat. Since your gymnastic work is likely a lot of shoulders and chest anyway, you might be able to ease up.

BTW I have seen your pics (as has everyone else here)...your shoulders do not need as much work as you think they do IMO.

I agree with the rest before and after gymnastics, it gives you the opportunity to really throw yourself into those workouts and give it 110%, since that is the hardest component for your competitions.

 

[Robboe]

Originally posted by J'Bo
Well that seems like a better idea.
There are only two problems:
-I will never be able to do the chest/delts/tris workout,i have a hard enough time doing chest/tris.
-I could never do legs after that workout because i wouldnt be able to move for the rest of the week.

Any more options.

As long as your pressing and pulling is progressing then your shoulders will be. No need to worry specifically about direct shoulder training like that. Besides, doing an extra two exercises in the workout (and possibly dropping a tricep movement since they'd be hit hard from chest pressing and overhead pressing) isn't gonna be that much harder.

And if that's a problem, then yeah, swicth push day with leg day.