Post post workout nutrition

[aad123]

I have a question for you guys out there regarding post post workout nutrition.

As a result of family commitments I do not get to the gym until 8pm, I workout for 1 hour max as the gym closes at 9pm. Following my workout I have a post workout shake made up of 40g protein, 20g maltodextrin, 20g glucose and 5g creatine. Now here is my problem. I have read that the post post workout meal should have complex carbs, protein and fats, however I have also read that you should avoid carbs in your last meal. I don't want to go from 9pm to 7.30 with no food but I don't want to consume carbs which will be held as fat. I also don't want my hard work in the gym to be waste of time because I haven't taken adequate nutrition.
I currently have 3 boiled eggs (1 yoke only) and one piece of whole grain toast (115cal 6g-pro 12g-carb 4g-fat).

Can anyone offer some advise on how I should tackle this problem.

Many thanks.

 

[ihateschoolmt]

You trying to gain weight or loose it? I don't know anything about cutting, but I'm bulking and I eat whatever the fuck I want before I go to bed haha.

 

[Marat]

You're not going to gain fat unless you are in an overall caloric surplus.

 

[BillHicksFan]

^ What Marat said is true and if you train late then you must eat you carbs late. There's no point burning glycogen during a training session and not replacing it.

 

[jagbender]

Casein Protein @ night would give you a slower release maybe mix whey and casein @ night. what Bill Hicks said too Carbs need to go back in your Muscle

 

[aad123]

Thanks for your replies.
I am currently trying to bulk but as clean as possible so a little body fat is not a major problem, I am also looking into a ph cycle so the extra body fat should get shifted then.
I have now added 100g of oats to my final meal on training days to ensure my body gets the required carbs. I will see how this goes and adjust the quantity of oats when / if required. I will also order some casein when I get my next batch or protein.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.

 

[Jodi]

I would suggest casein protein as well and I also wouldn't worry about adding a bit of complex carbs to your last meal either, you are bulking and your body needs it.

 

[Built]

Just eat some solid food after your shake and go to bed.

 

[aad123]

How long after my shake should I wait to eat again. I currently leave it 1 hour. Is this too little or too long ????

 

[Built]

It doesn't matter at all.

 

[aad123]

I thought you had to wait an hour so your body can absorb the nutrients from the shake quicker, as any fat (form a solid meal) will slow down the absorption. I may be wrong ?
Also what would you advise as a last meal in my position ? Eggs and oats is what I currently have. Is this ok or is there a better option ? Please bear in mind that I don't want to spend hours in the kitchen waking everyone up so quick and simple is the key.

 

[Built]

If you trained utterly fasted, it might make a difference. For most of us, this isn't the case. Get in your macros for the day, feed your workouts and don't worry about the rest.

 

[aad123]

I have a slightly unrelated question. I am planning a ph cycle in about 6 weeks. I have received a lot of good advise from this forum but I was wondering if for the 6 weeks prior to the cycle should I concentrate on cutting my body fat % down so that when I am on the cycle my gains are better. My thinking is if I restrict carbs prior to the cycle then when I start I re-introduce the carbs my body will react better. This I believe is the case when a competitive body builder starts bulking after a show. Because their bodies are so hungry for nutrients they are absorbed far better and this is the best period of growth. I could be mistaken though
My current estimated body fat is 22%(+-1%). This was taken from a website based on height, waist and neck measurements and body weight. I'm sure its not that accurate but is better than nothing.

 

[Built]

I have a slightly unrelated question. I am planning a ph cycle in about 6 weeks. I have received a lot of good advise from this forum but I was wondering if for the 6 weeks prior to the cycle should I concentrate on cutting my body fat % down so that when I am on the cycle my gains are better. My thinking is if I restrict carbs prior to the cycle then when I start I re-introduce the carbs my body will react better. This I believe is the case when a competitive body builder starts bulking after a show. Because their bodies are so hungry for nutrients they are absorbed far better and this is the best period of growth. I could be mistaken though
My current estimated body fat is 22%(+-1%). This was taken from a website based on height, waist and neck measurements and body weight. I'm sure its not that accurate but is better than nothing.

Do get your bodyfat down before you begin the PH, but don't go directly from cutting to bulking or much of the weight you gain will be bodyfat. After dieting for weight loss - no matter which diet you use - your insulin sensitivity will decrease. PHs will increase insulin sensitivity, but not instantly. Diet down to around 10-12% bodyfat, hold it there for a few weeks, and then slowly transition into your bulk as your PHs kick in.

How tall are you and what do you weigh btw? And where do you carry the majority of your bodyfat?

 

[Swedeheart]

I have a question for you guys out there regarding post post workout nutrition.

As a result of family commitments I do not get to the gym until 8pm, I workout for 1 hour max as the gym closes at 9pm. Following my workout I have a post workout shake made up of 40g protein, 20g maltodextrin, 20g glucose and 5g creatine. Now here is my problem. I have read that the post post workout meal should have complex carbs, protein and fats, however I have also read that you should avoid carbs in your last meal. I don't want to go from 9pm to 7.30 with no food but I don't want to consume carbs which will be held as fat. I also don't want my hard work in the gym to be waste of time because I haven't taken adequate nutrition.
I currently have 3 boiled eggs (1 yoke only) and one piece of whole grain toast (115cal 6g-pro 12g-carb 4g-fat).

Can anyone offer some advise on how I should tackle this problem.

Many thanks.

It doesnt matter that your training at night. Your body doesnt know it just wants nutrients post workout. Do not skip meals pwo and go that long without food.

Post workout your replenishing lost glycogen and refueling your body to start the repair and growth process. It doesnt matter if you train AM or PM eat your normal meal postworkout. There is no magical time that your body stores carbs as fat.

 

[aad123]

Do get your bodyfat down before you begin the PH, but don't go directly from cutting to bulking or much of the weight you gain will be bodyfat. After dieting for weight loss - no matter which diet you use - your insulin sensitivity will decrease. PHs will increase insulin sensitivity, but not instantly. Diet down to around 10-12% bodyfat, hold it there for a few weeks, and then slowly transition into your bulk as your PHs kick in.

How tall are you and what do you weigh btw? And where do you carry the majority of your bodyfat?

I'm 5ft8 and weigh 83kg (182lb). Most of my fat is around my waist and hips, with a little around my chest and legs. My upper abs are visible (if I breath in and crunch up a little). As for cutting I have never tried it with much success, I usually drop the weight but most of it seems to be muscle as my strength takes a real dip. I have read that dropping 250cal a week is about right. Would you agree. Any tips would be great.

 

[Built]

Read homework 1 in my sig. It's all there.

 

[aad123]

Read homework 1 in my sig. It's all there.

Thanks a lot. I have had a quick look at your homework section and I will read it more closely this week end. I already have a spreadsheet with cal, pro, carb & fat of most of the foods I eat so I will add up the numbers.

Just one question, I noticed that in the initial section you said that at roughly 10% body fat your abs would be slightly visible, would this be when stood at rest or when tensing the abs ? If its at rest then my body fat estimate may be correct at 22% but if its tensed then I may be lower than I thought.

Thanks again for the help, I really appreciate it.

 

[aad123]

I tried the fitday site but couldn't get to grips with it, most of the foods I was looking for were not there and after about 2 hours of trying I gave up. The site is not exactly user friendly. I may have been doing something wrong ?
Any way here are my average daily macros based on what I have managed to obtain from the info on the food packaging. The values are an average of monday to fridays meals. I have a log of all my typical foods on my pc so it was far easier to use that.

Kcal 2746
Carbs 215g (35.6%)
Pro 216g (35.8%)
Fat 77g (28.6%)

Break down of meals
07.30 k708 c71 p43 f14
10.30 k455 c45 p36 f12
13.00 k430 c45 p36 f25
15.30 k565 c17 p39 f17
18.00 k258 c24 p29 f3
22.00 k330 c13 p33 f6

My measurements are
Height 5ft 8
Weight 13st 5lb - 187lb
Arms 15.5"
Chest 42.5"
Waist 35.5"
Thigh 25.5"
Calf 15.25"
Est body fat 22%

I hope this info will help

 

[Built]

At 187, your diet is right where I would expect it to be for maintenance. To cut, drop your calories back by about 20% - about 500 or 600 calories a day less than you're eating now. Great info. You might find it easier to diet on three or four meals than on six little ones. Keep your protein up; if you cut your carbs in half you'll accomplish enough of a deficit to start dropping.

 

[ChrisSmithWebGuy]

You're not going to gain fat unless you are in an overall caloric surplus.

very true!

 

[aad123]

Thanks Built,
Got to grips with fitday and have started a daily log. Values are similar to what I had worked out. I will create a modified diet and start to cut my carbs as advised. I will also look at meal timings.
Do I count my post workout shake in my plans or does that cancel out the cals burned during the workout ?
Is there a better time to consume my carbs, I'm thinking b'fast, pre and post workout.

 

[Built]

No calories get cancelled, and everything you eat is a calorie you've consumed.

Breakfast is the worst time to eat carbs, if you're trying to modulate appetite. I stay low-carb and high-fat until dinner.

Best time would be before and or after training.

 

[aad123]

Just worked out my macros for today.
cal 2242
carb 176g (still too high, i will work on that)
pro 213g
fat 73g

Thanks for the tip on carbs for b'fast, that should get me down
a little more. I keep fine tuning till I get to where I need to be.
Just off to get my eggs and oats post workout.

Thanks

 

[aad123]

oh one question, by dinner do you mean 12 noon or 5pm. This can be very confusing in the uk.

 

[bigdaddymax]

if your working out late your metabolism will still be fired up at night and eat up the carbs in a hurry. At that time its probably best to have simple carbs so you can replenish your glycogen stores because if you have complex then go to sleep within an hour or two your body might store the slow digesting carbs. Just experiment with having simple carbs for several weeks then switch it up to see what is working

 

[aad123]

Today,s macros

cal 2075
carb 129 (going in the correct direction)
pro 225
fat 69 (a little low)

Felt a little hungry today about 1.5 hours after each meal so ended
up having 7 meals about 2 hours apart. Feeling positive about the diet
but realise it wont be easy after years of eating what I want.
I have noticed that my urine is smelling a little funny, like tuna or chicken difficult to pin point but definitely not normal?? any ideas.

 

[DaBeast25]

Breakfast is the worst time to eat carbs, if you're trying to modulate appetite. I stay low-carb and high-fat until dinner.

Best time would be before and or after training.

Just skimming through this... Built, what do you mean Breakfast is the worst time to eat carbs?

 

[Built]

I didn't say it was the worst time to eat carbs; I said breakfast is the worst time to eat carbs, if you're trying to modulate appetite. I thought that was self-explanatory.

Think of what's going to stick to you longer - a whey shake and eggs, or a bowl of oatmeal and eggwhites? Remember, we're talking about below-maintenance calories.

 

[aad123]

In your homework section you recommend compound movements so would I be better switching to a 3 day a week full body workout (Squats, deadlifts, bench, mill press, bent row and chins may be difficult to fit into 1 hour) or even a two workout split system (Workout 1. squats, bench, chins. Workout 2. deadlifts, mill press, bent row) alternating between the 2 workouts in rotation over 3 sessions a week.